Forums > Social Chat > Snakes?
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517 posts
Location: Sheffield, England
517 posts
Location: Sheffield, England
Posted:
Diana and the Cabiri,you mentioned 'snakes' when talking about clubs, and I've looked for websites. Lots mention them but none actually explain them at all. And if, as you said, Diana, they warrant a whole new grip then they must be pretty cool.so..... what are they?how do you do them?what's the special grip?I know how hard things are to explain in text so if you can't face trying to explain it then do you know of any web sites with a clip or instructions?cheers,Jo.
Diana and the Cabiri,you mentioned 'snakes' when talking about clubs, and I've looked for websites. Lots mention them but none actually explain them at all. And if, as you said, Diana, they warrant a whole new grip then they must be pretty cool.so..... what are they?how do you do them?what's the special grip?I know how hard things are to explain in text so if you can't face trying to explain it then do you know of any web sites with a clip or instructions?cheers,Jo.
Educate yourself in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
member
21 posts
21 posts
Posted:
Snakes? I assume not real ones? but they could be cool, add a new sense of danger to the performance if u use poisonous ones. sssssssss....sssssss...snake charming could be a performance idea there. Anyone know if you can get naturally flourescent snakes? Top for clubs and parties? But really, what are they if not the squirming on their belly ones?------------------*burn-baby-burn-disko-inferno*
Snakes? I assume not real ones? but they could be cool, add a new sense of danger to the performance if u use poisonous ones. sssssssss....sssssss...snake charming could be a performance idea there. Anyone know if you can get naturally flourescent snakes? Top for clubs and parties? But really, what are they if not the squirming on their belly ones?------------------*burn-baby-burn-disko-inferno*
*burn-baby-burn-disko-inferno*
AnonymousPLATINUM Member
Posted:
i'm no expert on club swinging but i've read a little about snakes in the 2 books i have (never seen them done though).It's a combination of moves isolating the wrist and elbow....it's seems that if its done properly then it looks pretty cool:i hope someone else who knopws more will fill in the gaps.
i'm no expert on club swinging but i've read a little about snakes in the 2 books i have (never seen them done though).It's a combination of moves isolating the wrist and elbow....it's seems that if its done properly then it looks pretty cool:i hope someone else who knopws more will fill in the gaps.
AnonymousPLATINUM Member
Posted:
OK, this'll be a new challenge! I've never tried explaining them to someone who couldn't see what I was doing. First I'll try to explain the most common variety of snakes. I call them vertical snakes for want of a better word. Start with one club in your dominant hand. With your arm straight out and your fore arm up at a 90 degree angle, hold the club so it hangs down against your arm. The snake grip is essentially holding the club the opposite way of a solid grip with a finger or two (depending on what's comfortable) over the knob. Your wrist should be twisted so it's facing outward. The overall concept is that you're rotating the club twice around the pivot point of your elbow. Your upper arm should not move through this entire skill. From upright, move your arm so it's parallel to the ground. On the first rotation, the end of your club should be behind your elbow. Continue the rotation till your arm is pointing down at 90 degrees. Your club is still behind your elbow. As you bring your arm up again, parallel to your upper arm, you'll be twisting you wrist slightly inward. When you get up to 90 degrees again, the club lay on the front of your arm. That's the first rotation. Do another rotation with the club in front, moving to the back at the same point and when you get to 90 degrees upright again, you've got a snake. The trick on the second half is keeping your arm straight enough that your club can pass on the inside. You can do this skill with two clubs synchronous or in follow motion. Don't forget backward, inward that is. You can also do them horizontally and at the hip. Hope this helps. Please do let me know if this makes any sense.Thanks, Diana
OK, this'll be a new challenge! I've never tried explaining them to someone who couldn't see what I was doing. First I'll try to explain the most common variety of snakes. I call them vertical snakes for want of a better word. Start with one club in your dominant hand. With your arm straight out and your fore arm up at a 90 degree angle, hold the club so it hangs down against your arm. The snake grip is essentially holding the club the opposite way of a solid grip with a finger or two (depending on what's comfortable) over the knob. Your wrist should be twisted so it's facing outward. The overall concept is that you're rotating the club twice around the pivot point of your elbow. Your upper arm should not move through this entire skill. From upright, move your arm so it's parallel to the ground. On the first rotation, the end of your club should be behind your elbow. Continue the rotation till your arm is pointing down at 90 degrees. Your club is still behind your elbow. As you bring your arm up again, parallel to your upper arm, you'll be twisting you wrist slightly inward. When you get up to 90 degrees again, the club lay on the front of your arm. That's the first rotation. Do another rotation with the club in front, moving to the back at the same point and when you get to 90 degrees upright again, you've got a snake. The trick on the second half is keeping your arm straight enough that your club can pass on the inside. You can do this skill with two clubs synchronous or in follow motion. Don't forget backward, inward that is. You can also do them horizontally and at the hip. Hope this helps. Please do let me know if this makes any sense.Thanks, Diana
member
517 posts
Location: Sheffield, England
517 posts
Location: Sheffield, England
Posted:
James, you are a nutter.I'll try and find some programmable strobe cobras for the next Dyonisus.But seriously, the 'snake' moves are most club swingers argument for them being superior to poi so I'm curious...Diana, cheers for helping me out. Just a couple of things though....I think i get what you mean, the club is sort of pivoting in its middle - like a very short staff. Is this right? What I don't understand is the second revolution. Is it supposed to go inside your arm or on the outside like the first one does (or that's what my first one does anyway....)?Jo.
James, you are a nutter.I'll try and find some programmable strobe cobras for the next Dyonisus.But seriously, the 'snake' moves are most club swingers argument for them being superior to poi so I'm curious...Diana, cheers for helping me out. Just a couple of things though....I think i get what you mean, the club is sort of pivoting in its middle - like a very short staff. Is this right? What I don't understand is the second revolution. Is it supposed to go inside your arm or on the outside like the first one does (or that's what my first one does anyway....)?Jo.
Educate yourself in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
AnonymousPLATINUM Member
Posted:
Firstly, Jo, I'm not saying clubs are "superior" to poi because of snakes. I'm saying "snakes" are a particularly challenging skill in club and are not literally replicable in poi. That doesn't make them better, only different. To answer your question, yes and no. The club is essentially pivoting in the middle, actually closer to the wick end. But unlike staff moves that pivot at the hand, the pivot point for this entire skill is the elbow. Hold a club in your hand in the starting position I've indicated, see how it lays against your arm. There'll be maybe 2/3 of the club against your arm and 1/3 below. So it'll pivot at the elbow, about 2/3 down the club. Come to think of it, I have done a pretty good replication of this on staff. So, check that out if you like. Ah, you're missing the transition. Once you begin to bring up the on the inside the third quarter of your rotation, twist your wrist slightly in. Once you complete the second rev, the inside of your forearm should be facing inside, facing you. Continue another quarter rev and when your arm is fully extended, the end of the club runs along the front side, the inside of the arm. This is where you want make sure your palm is facing forward. If you arm is rolled too far back, your elbow locks. If it's rolled too forward, it'll be harder to get the club end to pass your elbow on the front side. Each circle moves back and forth. With the forward or outer snake, The first rev is 1/2 rotation behind the elbow, 1/4 rotation transition, 1/4 rotation in front of the elbow. The second rev is the opposite 1/2 in front, 1/4 transition, 1/4 behind. BTW, the bracing the club against the arm thing is only for training purposes. When you're more used to it the club rest looser on the upper arm. Then your arm more resembles a snake coiling around the club. I hope this makes sense. Please let me know if you have any more questions. Diana
Firstly, Jo, I'm not saying clubs are "superior" to poi because of snakes. I'm saying "snakes" are a particularly challenging skill in club and are not literally replicable in poi. That doesn't make them better, only different. To answer your question, yes and no. The club is essentially pivoting in the middle, actually closer to the wick end. But unlike staff moves that pivot at the hand, the pivot point for this entire skill is the elbow. Hold a club in your hand in the starting position I've indicated, see how it lays against your arm. There'll be maybe 2/3 of the club against your arm and 1/3 below. So it'll pivot at the elbow, about 2/3 down the club. Come to think of it, I have done a pretty good replication of this on staff. So, check that out if you like. Ah, you're missing the transition. Once you begin to bring up the on the inside the third quarter of your rotation, twist your wrist slightly in. Once you complete the second rev, the inside of your forearm should be facing inside, facing you. Continue another quarter rev and when your arm is fully extended, the end of the club runs along the front side, the inside of the arm. This is where you want make sure your palm is facing forward. If you arm is rolled too far back, your elbow locks. If it's rolled too forward, it'll be harder to get the club end to pass your elbow on the front side. Each circle moves back and forth. With the forward or outer snake, The first rev is 1/2 rotation behind the elbow, 1/4 rotation transition, 1/4 rotation in front of the elbow. The second rev is the opposite 1/2 in front, 1/4 transition, 1/4 behind. BTW, the bracing the club against the arm thing is only for training purposes. When you're more used to it the club rest looser on the upper arm. Then your arm more resembles a snake coiling around the club. I hope this makes sense. Please let me know if you have any more questions. Diana
member
20 posts
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
20 posts
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
Posted:
I'm afraid I don't have much more to add after Diana's amazingly thorough responses.One thing, though - our club swinging teacher (one of the Flying Karamazov Brothers for all you juggling geeks out there!) told us that snakes aren't the best moves with fire clubs because the club doesn't actually *move* that much. it really stays close to the arm and the body almost the whole time, thus the cool spinning patterns created by larger swinging moves are lost.anyway... another club swinging book, which was available through Dube for a while, is a small white book titled simply 'Club Swinging' is a bit difficult to decipher (it was originally written in the 1800's...) but is very useful as it illustrates the patterns your clubs make when swinging. I'd recommend it.Happy swinging!Charly
I'm afraid I don't have much more to add after Diana's amazingly thorough responses.One thing, though - our club swinging teacher (one of the Flying Karamazov Brothers for all you juggling geeks out there!) told us that snakes aren't the best moves with fire clubs because the club doesn't actually *move* that much. it really stays close to the arm and the body almost the whole time, thus the cool spinning patterns created by larger swinging moves are lost.anyway... another club swinging book, which was available through Dube for a while, is a small white book titled simply 'Club Swinging' is a bit difficult to decipher (it was originally written in the 1800's...) but is very useful as it illustrates the patterns your clubs make when swinging. I'd recommend it.Happy swinging!Charly
AnonymousPLATINUM Member
Posted:
Charly,Yeah, I see what you mean about the fire itself not getting too much rotation. It's not something that's necessarily going to show well from too far back. The cool part is that because the fire is so close to the body, the crowd can get this adrenaline/danger response thing going. So, if you perform with the variations it heightens that reaction. I've worked out some on the hip snakes. And I'll tell you, I do them fast and stopping dead in a pose. Fast and stop. People freak out. It's the one skill, besides the human torch and the transfers, that I know folx will rock out on. Anyway, that's how my own experience has worked out. Thanks, Charly, for the kudos on my response. I'm honored.
Diana
Charly,Yeah, I see what you mean about the fire itself not getting too much rotation. It's not something that's necessarily going to show well from too far back. The cool part is that because the fire is so close to the body, the crowd can get this adrenaline/danger response thing going. So, if you perform with the variations it heightens that reaction. I've worked out some on the hip snakes. And I'll tell you, I do them fast and stopping dead in a pose. Fast and stop. People freak out. It's the one skill, besides the human torch and the transfers, that I know folx will rock out on. Anyway, that's how my own experience has worked out. Thanks, Charly, for the kudos on my response. I'm honored.
Diana member
341 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
341 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
Wow Dianna, those snake moves from the hip sound amazing. I'd love to see you perform them.
Wow Dianna, those snake moves from the hip sound amazing. I'd love to see you perform them.
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