Forums > Social Chat > insurance revisited - PLZ READ
Login/Join to Participatestarring Skippy the green llama
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
Posted:
Just got off the phone with the nice people at Clowns of the US, and although they're grandfathering the existing fire performers for the rest of this year(until April 25th), from now on fire performers are NOT covered under their insurance plan. I've done a little searching(and calling) through previous posts to find other companies(Hampson Mower Kreitz, COAI) have stopped covering fire performers as well. What gives? I would make the assumption that by the time a fire troupe invests in insurance, that they would have all of their safety procedures down, no worries. From looking around, it seems that COTUS covered alot if not most US performers, and I hope this doesn't come as a big shock to those of you with coverage. I'll continue searching and post any leads I find here, but does anyone else have an alternate plan already?? If so, please lend some help, I really need insurance to get fire permits in my area.
peace
Just got off the phone with the nice people at Clowns of the US, and although they're grandfathering the existing fire performers for the rest of this year(until April 25th), from now on fire performers are NOT covered under their insurance plan. I've done a little searching(and calling) through previous posts to find other companies(Hampson Mower Kreitz, COAI) have stopped covering fire performers as well. What gives? I would make the assumption that by the time a fire troupe invests in insurance, that they would have all of their safety procedures down, no worries. From looking around, it seems that COTUS covered alot if not most US performers, and I hope this doesn't come as a big shock to those of you with coverage. I'll continue searching and post any leads I find here, but does anyone else have an alternate plan already?? If so, please lend some help, I really need insurance to get fire permits in my area.
peace
First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica
" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."
BRONZE Member
Lambretta Fanatic
4,997 posts
Location: United Kingdom
Lambretta Fanatic
4,997 posts
Location: United Kingdom
Posted:
pretty sure this was discussed recently mate.
pele?? any idea's.
pretty sure this was discussed recently mate.
pele?? any idea's.
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Wait a second, I paid for one year from September. I'd BETTER be covered until then.
I won't need insurance for a couple of years after that because I'll be a third-year med student and won't be doing any paid gigs. But that is really annoying. Let us know if you find insurance somewhere else.
Wait a second, I paid for one year from September. I'd BETTER be covered until then.
I won't need insurance for a couple of years after that because I'll be a third-year med student and won't be doing any paid gigs. But that is really annoying. Let us know if you find insurance somewhere else.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
starring Skippy the green llama
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
Posted:
Afraid April 25th will be the cutoff, according to the info I was given. Still looking
Afraid April 25th will be the cutoff, according to the info I was given. Still looking
First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica
" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."
BRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
Posted:
Mike... Even if you paid in September and you look at your insurance you will find it was still only valid until April 25th. Clowns of the US did not offer pro-rated policies, which means everyone who purchased a liability plan from them fell into the APril 25th to April 25th policy. They also covered in their guidelines that the money is non-refundable if you go to April 25th. I am really sorry to be the bearer of bad news to you..please don't kill the messanger! (but you can tie me up and flog me if you wish! )
Actually, this news is not new, as it was decided before the first of the year. Sorry!
The company that sells COTUS the insurance to broker out received a video of what we do (not even a bad video, from my understanding) and became put off by it, thus insisting the coverage be pulled. COTUS is looking for an alternate provider, but as of yet has none. They are working closely with several fire performance groups as well as the NAFAA so even when they do offer it again, you will need to adhere to a strict safety code.
Clowns of American pulled insurance as well. Straight out Circus/Performers insurance costs a base of $3000 per group with an additional fee for each member (these companies insure shows for Florida and Las Vegas, if that gives you any clue as to what they are used to dealing with).
A friend of mine is a detective with an insurance company, and we are working to try to get coverage, but again it is only a huge if at this point and it will come with strict safety guidelines.
COTUS will make it known to the people they have provided for if and when further coverage is available.
And yes, they did cover most people in the US and Canada.
No, the don't need any more help or phone calls from fire peeps.
They are sorry for the inconvenience.
Hey, PK, what gave you the idea I would know anything about this?
[ 19. February 2003, 17:38: Message edited by: Pele ]
Mike... Even if you paid in September and you look at your insurance you will find it was still only valid until April 25th. Clowns of the US did not offer pro-rated policies, which means everyone who purchased a liability plan from them fell into the APril 25th to April 25th policy. They also covered in their guidelines that the money is non-refundable if you go to April 25th. I am really sorry to be the bearer of bad news to you..please don't kill the messanger! (but you can tie me up and flog me if you wish! )
Actually, this news is not new, as it was decided before the first of the year. Sorry!
The company that sells COTUS the insurance to broker out received a video of what we do (not even a bad video, from my understanding) and became put off by it, thus insisting the coverage be pulled. COTUS is looking for an alternate provider, but as of yet has none. They are working closely with several fire performance groups as well as the NAFAA so even when they do offer it again, you will need to adhere to a strict safety code.
Clowns of American pulled insurance as well. Straight out Circus/Performers insurance costs a base of $3000 per group with an additional fee for each member (these companies insure shows for Florida and Las Vegas, if that gives you any clue as to what they are used to dealing with).
A friend of mine is a detective with an insurance company, and we are working to try to get coverage, but again it is only a huge if at this point and it will come with strict safety guidelines.
COTUS will make it known to the people they have provided for if and when further coverage is available.
And yes, they did cover most people in the US and Canada.
No, the don't need any more help or phone calls from fire peeps.
They are sorry for the inconvenience.
Hey, PK, what gave you the idea I would know anything about this?
[ 19. February 2003, 17:38: Message edited by: Pele ]
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
starring Skippy the green llama
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
Posted:
Heh, member #18 who does this full time perhaps??
Thanks for the info Pele, once again you're a fount of pyro knowledge Instead of me continually bugging COTUS, can you keep this thread alive and keep us informed of any new developments??
Also, what did you mean by this Pele?
I have a few local leads to follow, but the prospect of explaining to a georgia insurance agent what exactly I need the insurance for is going to be ummmm interesting to say the least, most people around here don't even know what fire performances are, other than a few well placed flash pots on the kiss tribute band. I'd offer to help, but it sounds like the situation is well taken care of, too many chefs in the kitchen neh..
Heh, member #18 who does this full time perhaps??
Thanks for the info Pele, once again you're a fount of pyro knowledge Instead of me continually bugging COTUS, can you keep this thread alive and keep us informed of any new developments??
Also, what did you mean by this Pele?
quote:Huge event, huge policy, huge group?? But strict safety guidelines, sounds fine to me, as long as there isn't a restriction on types of performances as well.
but again it is only a huge if at this point and it will come with strict safety guidelines
I have a few local leads to follow, but the prospect of explaining to a georgia insurance agent what exactly I need the insurance for is going to be ummmm interesting to say the least, most people around here don't even know what fire performances are, other than a few well placed flash pots on the kiss tribute band. I'd offer to help, but it sounds like the situation is well taken care of, too many chefs in the kitchen neh..
First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica
" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."
BRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
Posted:
It is only a huge "if" as to whether or not it will go through at all, not just when but if type thing.
The guidelines will have restrictions on performers, safeties, tools, venues, etc....
I think things will align somewhere between Malcolm's voluntary safe performer program (which is mad strict on having a paper trail) and the NAFAA's guidelines.
I can keep you posted when/if I hear anything.
It is only a huge "if" as to whether or not it will go through at all, not just when but if type thing.
The guidelines will have restrictions on performers, safeties, tools, venues, etc....
I think things will align somewhere between Malcolm's voluntary safe performer program (which is mad strict on having a paper trail) and the NAFAA's guidelines.
I can keep you posted when/if I hear anything.
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
member
53 posts
Location: Denver, Co.
53 posts
Location: Denver, Co.
Posted:
Wow it's been a while since I've been to the site. Although I've really been focusing on my sideshow we still use a few fire acts in the show and we're starting to panic! So has anybody found anything as far as insurance??
Wow it's been a while since I've been to the site. Although I've really been focusing on my sideshow we still use a few fire acts in the show and we're starting to panic! So has anybody found anything as far as insurance??
How is it ever possible to feel safe and secure in a world in which everyone dies?
BRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
Posted:
Nothing new on the Eastern Front. As I have said before, insurance is available, for a really high price through circus insurance providers.
*shrug*
Nothing new on the Eastern Front. As I have said before, insurance is available, for a really high price through circus insurance providers.
*shrug*
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
stranger
1 post
1 post
Posted:
Controlled Burn from Reno was able to get group insurance. It took a ton of searching to find someone who was willing to write a policy but we found them.
For information, contact:
Mark N. Ashworth
Mt Rose Insurance
Home office 775-849-1050
Cell 775-335-6767
Please pass this info to anyone you think would like to check it out.
Sincerely, Wrangler
Controlled Burn from Reno was able to get group insurance. It took a ton of searching to find someone who was willing to write a policy but we found them.
For information, contact:
Mark N. Ashworth
Mt Rose Insurance
Home office 775-849-1050
Cell 775-335-6767
Please pass this info to anyone you think would like to check it out.
Sincerely, Wrangler
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