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Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Posted:
Was really disgusted last night to find out one of my friends was fired from a big club in Dublin cause the owner wanted her to take her top of at the end of a fire perfomance. I have only recently started performing in front of other people and am a little worried about where I want to go.
Can anyone share anything with regard to relationships between dancers and club owners. Should I expect no respect and to regarded as dispensable.
When my friend said no to him, he told her he is getting negative vibes off her (ya think) and just never phoned her again.
Was really disgusted last night to find out one of my friends was fired from a big club in Dublin cause the owner wanted her to take her top of at the end of a fire perfomance. I have only recently started performing in front of other people and am a little worried about where I want to go.
Can anyone share anything with regard to relationships between dancers and club owners. Should I expect no respect and to regarded as dispensable.
When my friend said no to him, he told her he is getting negative vibes off her (ya think) and just never phoned her again.
I live in a world of infinite possibilities.
BRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Posted:
Thats pretty terrible
What was the name of the club? I will tell all my friends to boycott the place, you tell all yours and by the end of the month, it will be effectively out of business if the grapevine in Dublin works like it used to.
I have never performed in a club so I'm afraid I don't have much information on the subject. I come from Mullingar where anything out of the ordinary is considered freakish including fire poi - I think many people in Eire might think of it more as a fetish thing than something people enjoy doing for the sheer thrill of it. Still does not excuse the club owner for being such a sexist pig.
I will be in Dublin Nov 22, I will be meeting up with friends but if you fancy meeting up for a spin let me know
Thats pretty terrible
What was the name of the club? I will tell all my friends to boycott the place, you tell all yours and by the end of the month, it will be effectively out of business if the grapevine in Dublin works like it used to.
I have never performed in a club so I'm afraid I don't have much information on the subject. I come from Mullingar where anything out of the ordinary is considered freakish including fire poi - I think many people in Eire might think of it more as a fetish thing than something people enjoy doing for the sheer thrill of it. Still does not excuse the club owner for being such a sexist pig.
I will be in Dublin Nov 22, I will be meeting up with friends but if you fancy meeting up for a spin let me know
Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.
- W B Yeats
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Posted:
Spirit. I've been there a few times and it is just one great big money grabbing machine. A friend of mine was telling me that when prince played in the point there last month, he said that the after party would be in Spirit. Everyone from the point legged it down to Spirit and when they realised what was happening, they jacked the admission up to 50 euros.....50 euros!!! This is after paying 60 euros for the original prince ticket. I dunno, I think they're all mad!!
Spirit. I've been there a few times and it is just one great big money grabbing machine. A friend of mine was telling me that when prince played in the point there last month, he said that the after party would be in Spirit. Everyone from the point legged it down to Spirit and when they realised what was happening, they jacked the admission up to 50 euros.....50 euros!!! This is after paying 60 euros for the original prince ticket. I dunno, I think they're all mad!!
I live in a world of infinite possibilities.
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Posted:
by the way I'd love to meet up. I'm doing a gig on the 22nd but I should be free on the saterday/sunday. Send us a mail when your on your way.
James.farrell@irishlife.ie
by the way I'd love to meet up. I'm doing a gig on the 22nd but I should be free on the saterday/sunday. Send us a mail when your on your way.
James.farrell@irishlife.ie
I live in a world of infinite possibilities.
member
250 posts
Location: Upland, CA., USA
250 posts
Location: Upland, CA., USA
Posted:
We just had a situation similar to that described, but we managed it okay and still have our gig and bras intact.
The promoter saw pictures of us all in war paint, costumes, and stuff at BM and was interested in the girls dressing the same way, i.e., topless.
I did all the negotiating. He never directly talked to the women.
After a group discussion and talking privately with each performer, I told him they would be willing to do it for more money. A lot more money. One hundred bucks each. He decided to pass on the boobage.
I told the women that if anybody tells them to take it off at the club to say "You have to talk to my agent about that," and send them to me.
Also I think having a male negotiate for the women kept them from feeling individually pressured or blackmailed by the guy.
My advice: keep it professional, let them know that there would be additional costs, have a manager or agent or troupe leader do the talking, and never take your top off for a creepy guy just to keep your job.
Maximus
We just had a situation similar to that described, but we managed it okay and still have our gig and bras intact.
The promoter saw pictures of us all in war paint, costumes, and stuff at BM and was interested in the girls dressing the same way, i.e., topless.
I did all the negotiating. He never directly talked to the women.
After a group discussion and talking privately with each performer, I told him they would be willing to do it for more money. A lot more money. One hundred bucks each. He decided to pass on the boobage.
I told the women that if anybody tells them to take it off at the club to say "You have to talk to my agent about that," and send them to me.
Also I think having a male negotiate for the women kept them from feeling individually pressured or blackmailed by the guy.
My advice: keep it professional, let them know that there would be additional costs, have a manager or agent or troupe leader do the talking, and never take your top off for a creepy guy just to keep your job.
Maximus
member
1,551 posts
Location: the arms of the Ganja Goddess
1,551 posts
Location: the arms of the Ganja Goddess
Posted:
what maximus said
what maximus said
You. Its whats for dinner!
As time passes, you realise all the mistakes you amde and the ones you wish you never did make.
The wave crashing on the beach
Diamond In The Rough
459 posts
Location: Richmond, Virginia
459 posts
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Posted:
Maximus,
I think you handled that very well, and very professionally, both with respect to your crew and the club owner. It showed you weren't completely closed to alternatives and that you want to accomodate your clients as much as possible.
Although, (if I HAD boobs), I'd probably have gone higher than a hundred bucks, but that might depend on the amount of exposure time...
This may be worthy of a separate thread, but how often do you find that fire and nudity cross paths?
[ 09. November 2002, 19:14: Message edited by: Prometheus ]
Maximus,
I think you handled that very well, and very professionally, both with respect to your crew and the club owner. It showed you weren't completely closed to alternatives and that you want to accomodate your clients as much as possible.
Although, (if I HAD boobs), I'd probably have gone higher than a hundred bucks, but that might depend on the amount of exposure time...
This may be worthy of a separate thread, but how often do you find that fire and nudity cross paths?
[ 09. November 2002, 19:14: Message edited by: Prometheus ]
Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.
Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.
SILVER Member
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
Good work Maximus, handled it well. But it is a real shame that the same respect would not be extended if a woman did the negotiating. It would just be viewed as "prudish" if she said no.
Breasts are breasts. They are soft & beautiful, and come in a range of different shapes, sizes & colours, just like people. They are a beautiful part of the female body. But when they go on display they seem to gain a life & meaning of their own, like they are somehow detached from you or not part of you. That is pretty freaky.
Good work Maximus, handled it well. But it is a real shame that the same respect would not be extended if a woman did the negotiating. It would just be viewed as "prudish" if she said no.
Breasts are breasts. They are soft & beautiful, and come in a range of different shapes, sizes & colours, just like people. They are a beautiful part of the female body. But when they go on display they seem to gain a life & meaning of their own, like they are somehow detached from you or not part of you. That is pretty freaky.
It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.
What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...
Pooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
Posted:
max da man. okay on a different note
in regards to said relationships, i would say that club owners and promoters are just as diverse as people. some are really cool and give you lots of drugs and drink tickets and want to show you the town afterwards and some treat you like they could care less. usu. as you get more experienced you won't have as many problems because you will start to perform for the same venues, or people who see you perform and approach you for your contact info. then if somebody feels weird when you talk to them, just don't do the show. find out exactly what they want beforehand, and tell them how much you want. keep a good attitude, and you will attract good people to you.
but, most of all, whether they are cool or not, (in fact, _especially_ if they are cool) GET HALF THE MONEY UP FRONT.
max da man. okay on a different note
in regards to said relationships, i would say that club owners and promoters are just as diverse as people. some are really cool and give you lots of drugs and drink tickets and want to show you the town afterwards and some treat you like they could care less. usu. as you get more experienced you won't have as many problems because you will start to perform for the same venues, or people who see you perform and approach you for your contact info. then if somebody feels weird when you talk to them, just don't do the show. find out exactly what they want beforehand, and tell them how much you want. keep a good attitude, and you will attract good people to you.
but, most of all, whether they are cool or not, (in fact, _especially_ if they are cool) GET HALF THE MONEY UP FRONT.
-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.
BRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
Posted:
Get an in writing contract and include a nudity clause. Alot of performers do that.
Yes, performers are easily disregarded, if you allow yourself to be. Club owners and promoters love to play the "You're not the only entertainment available" card as a way of trying to force their hand. It is bullshit and they know it. Decide these things in advance, make a moral stand, such as Maximus for his group, and don't back down from it. What are your personal limits in performing? Stick to them and it will get you respect as a professional in the end, even if you have to turn stuff down. The greatest power any person has is the power to say no.
The thing is, if a place like that wants someone topless, then they really could give two about the fire, they usually just want someone to show flesh, no matter what the other skill involved is. It was just a gimmick he wanted and his way of going about it was bullshit.
Get an in writing contract and include a nudity clause. Alot of performers do that.
Yes, performers are easily disregarded, if you allow yourself to be. Club owners and promoters love to play the "You're not the only entertainment available" card as a way of trying to force their hand. It is bullshit and they know it. Decide these things in advance, make a moral stand, such as Maximus for his group, and don't back down from it. What are your personal limits in performing? Stick to them and it will get you respect as a professional in the end, even if you have to turn stuff down. The greatest power any person has is the power to say no.
The thing is, if a place like that wants someone topless, then they really could give two about the fire, they usually just want someone to show flesh, no matter what the other skill involved is. It was just a gimmick he wanted and his way of going about it was bullshit.
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
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